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Pyrrha's death and why it doesn't make sense

Posts (42)

  • Jaws445

    Jaws445

    #33147524 - 2 years ago


    So let me start off saying I'm not trying to disrespect the RWBY crew and cast at all as well as Monty Oum this is my opinion and I may very well may be an idiot to all of you but I'm writing this to give criticism on the overall volume as well as hear your thoughts on this . This is also not a rant that she's not dead with stupid theory's or anything like that as I am fully aware of Jen Brown tweets stating Pyrrha confirmed death I'm just saying why its shouldn't have happened in the first place and here's why. It's ironic and not in a good way she is based on Achilles who had a very similar fate as well as her name also corresponds with Pyrrhic victory now these concepts sound very interesting on paper...but really only there think about it she's dead they use her as a motivator for the Main characters to keep going so what? I mean seriously they have a pretty decent developed character arguably more developed than the four main characters they can use it to their advantage but instead they use her death as motivation ? I mean If they needed motivation they wouldn't have stayed to try and save beacon they would have left and nothing in the development of the characters would ever suggest they were cowards and would run from the first sign of trouble so why use it on that." but you can say it's for Jaunes development so he can unlock he semblance "did you think he would never have found it if she was alive? you can also say he becomes more of leader because of her death ....so even with all that it isn't worth it. That's why it's ironic the Pyrrhic victory isn't on the plot itself but on the writers this concept of killing her wouldn't match the potential she had if she was alive furthermore her death wasn't even satisfying if I had to sum of her death it felt off really off the cryptic last words ,cinders tear, the immediate transition to ruby and Salem felt like" yeah she's dead bye" okay I get that she was never going to have a good ending as seen in the episode destiny but insignificant? they did more harm than good killing her off so much so that it felt half assed like they didn't care they just wanted to progress the story and yes you can say but they will explain in volume 4 ,well this should have been explained in volume 3 the whole Salem thing could have waited. Again sounds good on paper but looking at it more closely it's stupid there is the symbolic meaning where you can say "shit just happens "okay so are you saying next Weiss or Blake are going to get killed because "well shit happens just move on" there needs to still be some meaning or its just dumb. If I didn't know any better I would have thought this is really lazy writing but I'll assume they made mistake as I can see how it would sound cool but really looking into the whole plot and how it affects others in the story it's really stupid and not worth it which brings me to one other thing Ruby Weiss Yang and Blake are still too underdeveloped to start reacting the deaths of the peers especially on the third volume also one other mistake was that if you hadn't noticed they went from zero to a hundred. This volume was way too fast and made it sloppy they need to slow down and build their characters rather than keep throwing new obstacles at them. The reason Pyrrha is arguably more developed than them is because her conflicts were personal not oh bad guy fight done and she had to make a choice Yang ,Weiss Ruby and Blake didn't really have those conflicts they always had conflicts that were straightforward they never questioned themselves if what they were doing was right or not Pyrrha had to choose between her life as Pyrrha or her life as the fall maiden not ashes .

  • Burning_Zero

    Burning_Zero FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Gunpla is Freedom!

    #33147553 - 2 years ago

    Pyrrha's death isn't justified enough like the other animes where their deaths were justified not too mysterious or full of plot holes, I agree to you on that part

  • jordan_pyrrhaswaifu

    jordan_pyrrhaswaifu FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33147557 - 2 years ago

    In reply to Jaws445


    I kind of see what you are saying but I really think Pyrrhas death was set in stone since her development. Her name told us she was fated to go and what you don't see is that her death opened Rubys eyes, literally, and the fans that no one is safe in this show.


    I don't believe they used as a plot device to make the teams move further just an example of even the kindest of souls die


  • sataness

    sataness FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33147917 - 2 years ago

    I'll begin by saying that seeing Pyrrha die hurt me a lot, even though I saw it coming a mile away. She was, and will continue to be, one of my favourite characters in all of fiction. However, I love that the creator and the writers of RWBY were brave enough to do this. I love stories that make me think and challenge me emotionally. If all the characters are safeguarded from death in a dangerous world, suspension of disbelief is stretched too far and the story suffers.


    Pyrrha was a good, kind, humble, brave person who always thought of how she could help others. She had accepted a great responsibility, only to have the means to fulfill her duty taken away and given to the worst kind of person in her stead. She was told by some one she trusted that she would only get in the way if she tried to help take down this foe, and that she should instead go for reinforcements. When Ozpin failed to stop Cinder, she knew that if she went to summon reinforcements they would arrive too late to prevent the tower from falling. She made a terribly brave choice that was entirely within the bounds of what we have seen of her traits and motivations as a character. She knew she would die if she faced Cinder, but she also knew that the only hope lay in her stalling Cinder long enough for help to arrive. And she succeeded. Yes, the tower fell. But do we believe for a second that Cinder's plan stopped there? What did she intend to do with the dragon? I don't think that thing would have been stopped unless Pyrrha had stalled Cinder long enough for Ruby to make it to the top of the tower. Seeing Pyrrha's death unlocked something within Ruby, something she couldn't have accessed otherwise. She secured a pyrrhic victory, one that came with such loss that it could only be termed a victory because Salem didn't get everything that she wanted.


    Pyrrha died a hero, and I would rather her go out early in the story rather than the writers contrive to keep her around even though it doesn't make sense for her to do so, considering her brave and selfless nature.


    Stories are not solely about character, nor are they solely about plot. They are about setting up a world, creating well-rounded characters, presenting them with a conflict and allowing the characters to maneuver through the situations in ways that are consistent with their characterization. I believe volume 3 did this well. And if the pacing seems a bit strange, I think it fits. We were given hints of a conflict of great scope occurring just out of sight. We didn't know all the moves, or the stakes, just as most of our characters didn't. Salem and Cinder made their salvo quickly and with great force; grand and far-reaching consequences followed rapidly as a matter of course.


    To me, Pyrrha's death makes perfect sense.

  • Aerdoth

    Aerdoth

    #33148001 - 2 years ago

    People on other threads are also complaining about this. The consequences of Pyrrha Nikos' Death thread especially.

  • thesilentkid

    thesilentkid

    #33149518 - 2 years ago

    In reply to MEK1724


    Now, Jaune isn't confirmed to have gotten any help, bar Ruby, and it doesn't take 2 people to operate a phone. So Pyrrha wouldn't have gotten extra help. However had Pyrrha gone with him, and then split up and searched on foot they may have then found help where Jaune didn't on his own.

    It doesn't take 2 people to use a phone, no, but 2 people on 2 phones can contact more people faster than 1 person on 1 phone. As Pyrrha & Jaune would of both used their Comm. device.

  • thesilentkid

    thesilentkid

    #33154439 - 2 years ago

    In reply to MEK1724

    Ah, that does make sense, the thought of her not even having her Scroll (I've remembered the names of the things) on her person at the time never went through my mind, but i wouldn't call them fragile, would the not be designed to survive situations like combat and whatnot?

  • WrightKnight

    WrightKnight

    #33174909 - 2 years ago

    In reply to DashingNative

    Your questions about Ozpin are why people think there's level of ambiguity in Pyrrha's death. There are theories out there that allow for the continued use of the character, whether or not she is alive, and some that can even be weaved into a well-written revival. While I am in the camp of "Pyrrha can be brought back", I'm not going to agree with your views of the character of people that agree with the death. I'll wonder about their ability to recognize good writing from bad, as well as wonder about possible bias in favor of RT's prior work, but I won't attack them as people for being ok with Pyrrha's death.

  • unsold_hearts

    unsold_hearts

    #33181419 - 2 years ago

    In reply to DashingNative

    Claiming you judge whether someone's opinion is worthy of being considered in a conversation only if it falls in line with your own and you get upvotes, color me surprised.

  • user-56b6b344112f3

    user-56b6b344112f3

    #33181717 - 2 years ago

    I kinda thought of it like Kamina- she died relatively early in the series when we weren't expecting it, and in the process the protagonist unlocks a new ability.

    Also: Pyrrha was only invincible up until then because she used her Polarity Semblance to manipulate metal weapons and armor to her advantage. Cinder wears no armor and fights with weapons made of glass.

  • ChazzaWard

    ChazzaWard FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Theoretical Skeptic

    #33182884 - 2 years ago

    In reply to DashingNative


    I also watched it and felt it was not actually dealing with problems with the death but instead was an emotional response pertaining to why they were personally unhappy with it. If the arguments in it were so compelling do you wish to summarize them here for all to discuss?


  • takecareofKnives

    takecareofKnives

    #33329387 - 1 year ago

    In reply to MEK1724 you need a tdlr, good thing at the end you said not making sense is not a reason to be skeptical so I could still tell that you are dumb as rocks.

  • acw28

    acw28

    #33329785 - 1 year ago

    A little off topic but since we now know that the bodies of Remnant's citizens don't automatically turn to dust after they die, I have to ask what the point of Cinder burning Pyrrha's body was? I understand having the symbol of conquering a powerful enemy (which way to go Team Evil, you defeated the world's most powerful high school student; yet the Military General, the expert drunk, and a number of teachers are still alive), but wouldn't it have more of a psychological impact if the public saw a body?


    It could just be nothing, but since we know Salem is pulling the strings behind the curtains it would seem like it was part of her grand plan. I think Pyrrha is dead and the only way we'll see her in the future will be through Jaune's recorded lessons, but I can't help but wish for something more. I'm not talking about a full resurrection where she goes back to an everyday live with Teams RWBY and JN_R, but I wouldn't rule out Salem resurrecting her in a "Grimm-like" state to battle Team RJNR and force Jaune to literally battle his issue of feeling like the group's weak link and how he never noticed Pyrrha's love until it was too late.

  • Burning_Zero

    Burning_Zero FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Gunpla is Freedom!

    #33329961 - 1 year ago

    a long and slow journey for us to see the characters to get their vengeance.

  • takecareofKnives

    takecareofKnives

    #33329987 - 1 year ago

    In reply to MEK1724 Its so obvious that some people like you on here are hoping Pyrrha's dead just for the gimmick of killing one of the best characters. It's obviously not good for the story, and you have literally said it makes sense and it doesn't make sense, and skepticism is not warranted. My point obviously still stands because you literally contradicted the fuck out of yourself at least twice effectively bringing your credibility down to a goose egg. Even if you don't want to be skeptical that doesn't mean that over half of the fan base can't be skeptical, and we are.

  • takecareofKnives

    takecareofKnives

    #33330002 - 1 year ago

    In reply to MEK1724Never will I, or probably most anyone else read these walls of text your putting out. Everyone including you should spend their time better than that. Skimmed it out of pity though...something about being autistic? Checks out.

  • takecareofKnives

    takecareofKnives

    #33330012 - 1 year ago

    In reply to MEK1724lmao just told you I pity skimmed it...do you read? No you just spout huge piles of nonsense. Guess what else I skimmed in about literally 2.5 seconds. You tried to tell me you can say whatever, it doesn't matter nobody needs to respond, criticisms and discussions are both meaningless blah blah. Kinda awesome you think I might be psychic. I read and it's a good use of time just not walls of text from someone who is literally devoid of credibility. *insert retaliation nonsense personal attack here*

  • takecareofKnives

    takecareofKnives

    #33330029 - 1 year ago

    lol citation or quotes needed make your posts more redundant and elaborate like me! Like nah g...how bout you scroll up, takes half a second. Really not trolling, that's literally what you were JUST arguing. Anything you say 8 months ago is untouchable? Now who's trolling? You really had this conversation in my profile because when you debate in threads nobody takes your side right?

  • Aleksandr926

    Aleksandr926

    #33330051 - 1 year ago

    Pyrrha's death made sense, but not in the way it was executed.

    First, we should note it was an in-character decision. Pyrrha was pretty much selfless and brave, so it's understandable for her to try and defeat Cinder without taking Jaune with her. He's weak and it was too dangerous for him. Maybe Pyrrha knew she had no chance of winning, but still believed to be able to buy some time before Qrow and Glynda reinforcements.

    And here come the first problems: it doesn't make sense that Pyrrha's death was the one to unlock Ruby's silver eyes power. The young Huntress already witnessed Penny being destroyed by her own wires (live!) and saw her teammates (and one of them was her sister) severe injuries. Weren't they shocking enough? 

    Sure, there are a few possible solutions:

    - Despite declaring to see Penny as a normal girl, Ruby in her heart was aware of Penny's robotic nature and thought: "Well, they can rebuild her, right?"

    - Ruby is totally insensitive towards Yang and really believed that losing an arm was OK.


    Obviously, everyone knows this is not the case. Pyrrha's death was the worst possible choice to unleash Ruby's secret power. They had no interaction at all during 3 volumes! Maybe there were some generic lines of dialogue, but I wouldn't call them bonding moments. 

    Making Jaune die would have been a much better choice, since he had a good relationship with Ruby and would have demonstrated how cruel and ruthless the villains were, to the point of even killing the most helpless student. 

    Speaking of Jaune, why the hell did he call Weiss instead of Glynda? Did he want to be the brooding vengeful hero of Volume 4 so much? 


    Ending: killing a main character is OK, even as a plot device, but it has to be well thought. And this wasn't the case.

  • takecareofKnives

    takecareofKnives

    #33330088 - 1 year ago

    Wow I really appreciate talking to a thoughtful person on this for once(a lot of people seem to just say I like Yang better so good for RT for not caring like me). I really was thinking about Pyrrha's choice the way you were for a while but then I decided that she couldn't have been waiting for reinforcements after the scene with her magnetically using the elevator. Like, she had to have believed she was alone at that point. Yea the Ruby power thing is just another fucked up aspect too. I have to go beyond what you're saying though, because I honestly think they are going to bring her back similarly to a certain walking dead character who has just been killed in that show, if you know what I mean. It's really just not adding up. I truly don't believe RT would jag with her characters death to the point where so many are as skeptical as I am. I really like what you said about if RT just wanted a cruel meaningless death Jaune's wouldn't have been far superior choice to Pyrrha. However I disagree that they should be trying for that kind of gimmicky death at all. Truly I think RT can, and is currently make a better show than that.

  • ChazzaWard

    ChazzaWard FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Theoretical Skeptic

    #33330256 - 1 year ago

    In reply to MEK1724 

    Long time no see, is your thoroughness to arguing your point still pissing off people who are used to arguing within twitters 140 characters?

  • Aleksandr926

    Aleksandr926

    #33330324 - 1 year ago

    In reply to takecareofKnives


    Well, I thought a lot about Pyrrha's death. She was (and still is) my favorite character. At first, I liked her design, and then, little by little, she grew on me. What hurts the most is that she died right when she was developing as an independent character. Before Volume 3, she was mostly tied to Jaune's storyline: she helped unlocking his aura, she taught him how to fight, he made her create her first friendships an so on. Except maybe for those few minutes in "Dance dance infiltration", the Maidens plotline was the first chance to explore her personality as an individual of her own.


    I'm not usually fond of deaths as plot devices or as means to prove a point (how weak the heroes are compared to the villains, how evil the latters are, etc.), even if some of the most famous anime feature this element. Sometimes it's well done and sometimes is not. What ticks me off is when a tragic event is not related to the person who undergoes it, but to the protagonist or someone else. In this case, most of the times the victim stops being a person and becomes an instrument. 

    It would have been fine if Pyrrha was killed by Cinder and that was it. She would have sacrificed herself fullfilling her ideals and her destiny to protect the people. Her death stopped being her own the moment Ruby stepped in and unleashed her mysterious and not foreshadowed power. 


    I'm sorry if I keep talking about the silver eyes thing, but it really upsets me. The whole premise of RWBY was that the victory was in a simple soul. I thought we were going to see a group of young heroes fighting desperately against unbelievable evil powers, winning through sheer determination, sacrifice, training and diligence. Now it's another chosen one story. And if Jaune's semblance is also superstrong, it would be a story about two chosen ones. 

  • WrightKnight

    WrightKnight

    #33330329 - 1 year ago

    Alexsandr, you have just shown precisely why the "Stuffed in the Fridge" trope is so distasteful: it devalues the character being killed to the point where the death was the only thing that ultimately mattered, and not even to themselves Han Solo was a better death because HE was the one driving that final scene, not Kylo Ren. Not a damn thing in Pyrrha's death was about her, just showing off how powerful Cinder had become (since we did not get to see it while fighting Ozpin)) and Ruby's Silver Eyes. If it stands, she was nothing more than a prop for others.

  • Burning_Zero

    Burning_Zero FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Gunpla is Freedom!

    #33331622 - 1 year ago

    You're are saying that the good guys have Zero chance of defeating any antagonist, that's where i got this from. Be patience their time will come.

  • JROY

    JROY FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Gaurdian Lvl.2

    #33332678 - 1 year ago

    huh...never found this thread. So is this a Pyrrha might come back thread or her death was stupid thread?