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RWBY Volume 5: In-Depth Discussion/Speculation/Spoilers (All Things Must Die {FINALE})

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  • 4654ryan

    4654ryan FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33726912 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninja

    I believe dust could be the remains of the Gods. It is said I the very first chapter that humanity came from dust and that this dust would eventually save them so if you could infer that when it says humanity came from dust they are talking about the gods.


    People are so quick to try and disprove ad dismiss the Gods because they are kind of binary and boring.

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33726917 - 5 months ago

    In reply to 4654ryan

    They are considered binary and boring because people didnt give them a chance at all. We know almost nothing about them.

    They got introduced and people were already saying they dont matter and like things. RWBY has shown it likes to plant a plot then come back later.

    So with the knowledge that Salem's backstory is soon and with her flat out being tied to the gods we are most likely going to find out a LOT more about them just by association.


    People have honestly not given them a chance on the subject and that is a mistake because its not like they cant play with our views and understanding. For example take Goblin Slayer where the Gods are literally playing a DnD game with Mortals. The 2 gods are Illusion and Truth. Truth is shown to be the Cruel and general nasty one as he LIKES making it super difficult Illusion on the other hand loves her Mortals and their stories.

    In this case they are playing up Illusions are meant to be comforts while Truth can be cruel and merciless.


    CRWBY can do the same with the gods we currently dont know. Darkness was attacking Lights creations but Humans are Darkness creation as well so he may truly love them and become the example of soft comforting darkness instead of the scary and cruel darkness he was before humans.


    All of that is possible but people havent given them a chance and wrote them off as soon as they were even hinted at.


    So no I dont agree with the Binary and Boring at all.

  • InsaneAlphaBeta

    InsaneAlphaBeta

    #33726920 - 5 months ago

    Somewhat on topic, i wouldn't be surprised if either the gods returned to remnant, or we see them in some kind of flashback. Speaking of which i wouldn't mind an Ozpin and Salem flashback too. (Which could actually include the gods aswell.)


    I don't know how much ti changes or helps the topic. But i do think the gods are alive even though they left remnant. Just because we know Ozpin and Salem were around before the gods left Remnant (i discovered evidence to support that awhile ago) doesn't automacticly mean they are the gods like some people suspect, afteral Oz said the gods cursed him for failing to stop Salem in the past. (and notebly didn't stop or do anything to salem.) So unless he cursed himself, which he wouldn't need to, it doesn't add up.


    Also of note, Salem did confirm in the very first episode that while she may look like a grimm, she is human. So im curious how all of that will play out, and if we will ever see the gods. We have seen the incredible power of a maiden before, imagine the power of a god.

  • EmeraldKiwi94

    EmeraldKiwi94

    #33726940 - 5 months ago

    In reply to InsaneAlphaBeta


    Where was it confirmed Salem was human? I'm looking at the first episode transcript and I don't see it anywhere. She doesn't refer to herself as part of mankind as far as I can tell.

  • InsaneAlphaBeta

    InsaneAlphaBeta

    #33726963 - 5 months ago

    In reply to EmeraldKiwi94


    In the very first sentance she ever spoke she says this.


    "Legends. Stories scattered through time. Mankind has grown quite fond of recounting the exploits of heroes and villains, forgetting so easily that we are remnants, byproducts, of a forgotten past."


    Notice that when talking about Mankind, she said we are remnants, byproducts, of a forgotten past. Her saying we would indicate that she is part of mankind, otherwise she would have said they which would exclude her as one of them, instead she said we are remnants, making her a part of mankind.


  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33726966 - 5 months ago

    In reply to InsaneAlphaBeta

    No she is talking about Heroes and Villains when she says that.

    She says mankind is fond of recounting the exploits of Heroes and Villains then says the we are remnants.

    That is why she says forgetting so easily she is indicating humanity doesnt recall that the heroes and villains they are so happy to talk about, which salem is one, are of a forgotten past.


    She is directly linking the heroes and Villains as being of a forgotten past. In this case she is indicating herself in that.

    That is why she uses WE its not Mankind she is talking about when she uses it but Heroes and Villains being remnants of the past.


    That doesnt indicate she is human

    It just means she sees herself as either a hero or Villain which Humanity is quite fond of recounting their tales.

    And considering Ozpin there is a fair chance that the most common Heroes and Villains of their time is actual her and Ozpin fighting.


    So I think you are taking it in a way the writers didnt mean for it to be. Because she is talking about heroes and villains explots being retold but forgetting they are just remnants of a forgotten past.


    Keep in mind its not the first time writing indicated something they didnt mean and they later explained it. They had this happen with WOR on Aura which a LOT of people took to mean its always on when they actually meant its not something you need to control when its on.


    So it should read like this

    "Legends. Stories scattered through time. Mankind has grown quite fond of recounting the exploits of heroes and villains, (Mankind) forgetting so easily that we (Heroes and Villains) are remnants, byproducts, of a forgotten past."


    Now to be clear that doesnt mean Salem ISNT human or was once human. Just the line doesnt seem to work in the way you present it as is all. 

    It may turn out Salem might indeed be human or was once human.

  • InsaneAlphaBeta

    InsaneAlphaBeta

    #33726968 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninja


    Huh, never thought of it that way, interesting.

    Well, atleast all the other evidence i found surrounding Ozpin and Salem still holds up for now.

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33726969 - 5 months ago

    In reply to InsaneAlphaBeta

    Yeah a lot of plays do this where they expect you to get it but the language has drifted so its not as obvious. Or they are keeping a plot twist but want people who see it later to go OOOOHH.

    With the voice overs I think its because they were trying to keep the secrets, since Salem wasnt a known thing at the time, a surprise. So I think that is the confusion they were intentionally trying to be obtuse to hide that Salem isnt normal.


    As for the Idea Ozpin and Salem were around before the Gods left I think you are right. Ozpin specifically states he was cursed by the gods which means the gods were around to do it. And since the reason he was cursed was because he didnt stop Salem thus both were around before the gods left like you think.


    We are suppose to get Salem's backstory soon so I think we will find out.

  • tin-foilhat

    tin-foilhat FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33726998 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninj


    When did we say we are going to be getting Salem’s back story soon? I remember Kerry saying he was eager to explore it but nothing about when it is coming. For all we know this could be a case of “Neo is in season five” fan mis-conception all over again.

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33727013 - 5 months ago

    In reply to tin-foilhat

    DVD commentary from what I read

    Supposedly we are going to find out what the Relics actually do again commentary so I think it might all be linked.


    But you are right it could be a fan-misconception again but this one I think is most likely true. The reason for it is now the main cast KNOWS about Salem so it makes sense to actually explain her and if they use the Relic of Knowledge we get several birds with one stone.

    1 show Salem's past

    2 Show Ozpin's past as they are heavily linked

    3 show the relics and their powers without needing to explain.

    4. The gods since they are the ones who cursed Ozpin


    So I wont be surprised if its all tied together. 

  • Bumblebee4life

    Bumblebee4life

    #33727226 - 5 months ago

    In reply to revanninja

    I just hope Salem doesn't end up becoming another Snoke

  • acw28

    acw28

    #33727256 - 5 months ago

    In reply to Bumblebee4life

    I think she's actually gotten more screen time than him...

  • Bumblebee4life

    Bumblebee4life

    #33727453 - 4 months ago

    In reply to acw28

    You know what I mean building up the character and then killing them off for the sake of "subversion"

  • tin-foilhat

    tin-foilhat FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33727470 - 4 months ago

    In reply to Bumblebee4life


    Ned Stark? 

  • lena27

    lena27

    #33727720 - 4 months ago

    In reply to revanninja

    I'm betting that she was including herself when she said "we" because she was once human.

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33727731 - 4 months ago

    In reply to lena27

    I am pretty sure she isn't when she gives her speech at the end of vol 3 she is speaking like an outside observer and doesn't imply she is human.

    Now she might have been human once but she may not think or refer to herself as one.

    The we was entirely the heroes and villains part.


    And part of that was to hide Salem so people don't clue in to the supernatural nature.


    From my phone 

  • tin-foilhat

    tin-foilhat FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33727742 - 4 months ago

    In reply to revanninja


    It could be a case where once she was human but no longer views herself as such. She could have been part of a history of humanity before mutating into whatever she is... now.

  • revanninja

    revanninja FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold One who is judged by the

    #33727775 - 4 months ago

    In reply to tin-foilhat

    Possible I have seen like things in other shows.

    But the thing to keep in mind is most likely whatever changed Salem is the same thing Ozpin couldnt stop which means this is the time of the gods however long that might have been.

    So its possible Salem has only 20 to 30 years as a human and thousands of years as whatever she is. 

    So she may not even recall what its like to be human because to her its been so long ago and such a small part of her life.


  • Dinobot01

    Dinobot01 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33727787 - 4 months ago

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieb0QYfRmWoThis is a very good theory

  • simcrad

    simcrad

    #33727806 - 4 months ago

    In reply to tin-foilhat

    I don't think that Salem has changed. She could be Younger Brother's daughter. This explains her control over grimm and nonhuman appearance.

    Demigod theory alos explains silver eyes - they are Elder Brother's descendants.

    PS.

    What trait does Younger Brother's descendants possess? Red eyes?

  • ZanyGamer196

    ZanyGamer196 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33728457 - 4 months ago

    In reply to revanninja

     Ooh, good points, which coincide with the opening dialogue between Salem and Ozpin at the start of the series.


    Ozpin: But perhaps, victory lies in the simpler things you have long forgotten.  Things that require a smaller, more honest soul.


     So it could be that Salem has indeed forgotten what it is to be human, possibly one of her few weaknesses.  And, in time, may prove to be a fatal one.