Forums > RWBY

LGBT Representation in RWBY

Posts (11)

  • finnichi

    finnichi FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    #33684268 - 7 months ago

    Hey everyone! This is actually my first time posting to the RT Forums. Usually I'm not big into forums, but this is a subject that I needed to get more public with. SPOILERS: Illya was just confirmed to be lesbian. Or rather, as confirmed as we'll ever get. And while I'm loving the story implications its providing, a few of my friends are actually quite upset. They believe the way they went about introducing the first LGBT main character was wrong, and that she shows the "Psychotic Lesbian Trope". As much as I try to argue that she's not psychotic, they still believe that its poor representation. POTENTIAL SPOILER WARNING: I actually believe that Illya's fate is to die by the end of this season. She represents what Blake could have been if she had stayed with the White Fang, and how she would have inevitably met a terrible fate. She also represents the horror of Adam's corruption, and may spur Blake to put her foot down and face Adam once and for all. HOWEVER, this idea also upsets my friends as they think that shows the "Bury Your Gays Trope". So I'm at a loss. I know for a fact that Miles and Kerry would never do anything malicious just because their character is gay. I myself am not LGBT. I'm a straight male with nothing but love and support for my friends, but only basic knowledge of the LGBT community. So am I in the wrong here for thinking that RWBY didn't poorly represent the first "confirmed lesbian" (honestly even thats not entirely true)? I am ignorant on the subject, so I'm not trying to do this to say "HA I WIN!" I'm doing this to learn what the community, specifically the LGBT community, thinks about this subject. Thanks!

  • WrightKnight

    WrightKnight

    #33684276 - 7 months ago

    Check out the "queerbaiting" topic thread for more on this very topic, covered four months before Ilia was confirmed LGBT, specifically my responses to various people.  That is EXACTLY what played out: that people see "gay antagonist" and forget or ignore that the reveal of Ilia being a lesbian didn't actually change anything about the dynamic between Blake and Ilia, nor is her LGBT status the reason why she's an antagonist.  Ilia's reason for being an antagonist has ALWAYS been tied to her affiliation in the White Fang and her loyalty to that cause.  Moreover, by process of elimination based on how people would have reacted to various characters being LGBT (as hypotheticals), it was very clear that the only representation, especially that of a couple, that would be acceptable would have been Yang and Blake, and as you said yourself, they'd ALSO be accused of "Burying the Gays" if a such character was killed, so their status as LGBT would ALSO be Plot Armor.

    1: Supporting cast would not have been accepted due to the view that RT would be trying to "Hide the Gays"

    2. Antagonists would not be accepted due to the history behind LGBT in fiction, including guidelines like the Hays Code for comic books.

    Here's the link to the topic thread I mentioned.  Again, this took place several months ago.

    http://roosterteeth.com/forum/rwby/topic/3396836

  • RWBimbie

    RWBimbie Keeper of Poems

    #33684313 - 7 months ago

    In reply to WrightKnight

     it was very clear that the only representation, especially that of a couple, that would be acceptable would have been Yang and Blake, 

    Yup, that set of fans made it VERY clear.


    The LGBTQXYZ topic comes every year.

    When we see folks of that community completely disregard the lgbt characters in show that are not spotlighted,  special, or flaming enough for their demands.


    When I was watching RWBY, I saw a world where gender didnt matter: a world of true gender equality where it was NOT weird or special to be that way- they had equality and total acceptance.  Somehow that isnt enough for some folks: Some fans demand the lgbt be more than just the same as everyone else in show.


    There was nothing weird or special about the gay guys we saw... why have show point out 

    LOOK LOOK! Everybody look at these gay guys!!!

    Instead, we are shown a world where that has such equality and acceptance that its NOT SPECIAL.


    RWBY has other LGBT characters to see and say, 

    Hey, its great that they are treated just like everyone else.  

    But somehow that isnt good enough for some folks.  They are not seeing the equality to celebrate, they are creating excuses to complain.  Frankly, its insulting to the other existing lgbt characters in show 

    to be discounted and kicked to the curb as not-flaming-enough 

    by the folks claiming to support lgbt.


    We are shown a fictional world 

    where Torture & Domestic Abuse is supposed to Good & Acceptable

    and where LGBT have complete equality and acceptance 

    ....somehow the part fans say is wrong is the lgbt equality?

  • ashistrash

    ashistrash

    #33684701 - 7 months ago

    I do think it's ridiculous that fans are shoving Ilia into the "psycho lesbian" box. Ilia may be part of an antagonistic group of people, and may be succumbing/being manipulated to Adam's way of thinking, but she's definitely not a psycho. Her crush on Blake -- and Blake not feeling the same -- has nothing to do with why she's going against her; it's all down to how the WF have been manipulating her, as well as the trauma she's suffered in the past. Ilia is a multi-dimensional, complex, and tragic character, and it's an insult to her character to shove her into the "psycho lesbian" trope box. As a member of the LGBT+ community, I'm really happy with how RT handled Ilia "coming out", and I'm excited to see which other characters are part of the community too (if there are anymore, of course)!

  • GammaEmerald

    GammaEmerald

    #33684706 - 7 months ago

    In reply to RWBimbie

    You make an interesting argument. TVTropes has a thing called “Truth in Television” where a trope is a reflection of real life. What your post is telling me is that since RWBY isn’t having “Truth in Television” when it comes to real world acceptance of the LGBT community, the LGBT community is upset.

  • RWBimbie

    RWBimbie Keeper of Poems

    #33684744 - 7 months ago

    There is nothing to really worry about regarding Illa.

    Blake should just agree to have dinner with her

    then beat her in Domestic Violence like all other Domestic relationships Blake has had.

    Blake attacked Adam

    Blake attacked Sun

    Blake attacked Sun... again

    So it just seems common sense that the patter of Domestic Abuser Blake will beat up Illa.


    Heck, idk why folks want to see Bumblebee happen- 

    It will just end with Blake Domestic Abusing Yang,

    because the writers and animators repeatedly shown Blake has a pattern of violently abusing relationships

  • GammaEmerald

    GammaEmerald

    #33684748 - 7 months ago

    In reply to RWBimbie

    Ba-scuse me?

  • WrightKnight

    WrightKnight

    #33684750 - 7 months ago

    In reply to finnichi

    THIS is what I was warning you about, finnichi .  This is how he derailed the topic I linked and ultimately got it ended.

  • GammaEmerald

    GammaEmerald

    #33684753 - 7 months ago

    Wow. Way for him to take a compliment and flush it down the toilet.

  • RWBimbie

    RWBimbie Keeper of Poems

    #33684762 - 7 months ago

    Its hardly flushing a compliment down the toilet.

    Gamma wanted to isolate the Badguyness of Illa from the LGBTGXYZness.

    I simply extended that

    to point out Blake could take out THE BADGUY Illa by exploiting her irrelevant LGBTness.


    This is nothing new to espionage.

    For centuries, if not longer, sides of conflicts employed Temptresses in espionage to gather intel or assassinate key enemy targets.

    What if the enemy is LGBTQXYZ?

    Well, we saw Bruce Willis deal with the Espionage against LGBT targets in that JACKAL movie... right?  Why would we suspend common knowledge of the easy solution in order to create a problem for LGBT integration?


    The easiest way to kill the enemy is to present to them what they want

    ... then stab them in the back.

    Why would tried & true espionage standards change for LGBTQXYZ?


    If Illa is a badguy, take them out.

    Easiest way to do that is espionage rather than frontal assault.

    So you have to have the right bait for your intended prey.




    Common


    Sense


  • 09philj

    09philj

    #33685412 - 7 months ago

    In reply to dustmagick

    According to the Office for National Statistics here in Britain, in their 2016 sexual identity survey, 2% of people surveyed identified as gay or bisexual. That's a lot of people, even if we assume nobody falsely claimed to be straight. Human society includes queer people, and if you're building a large fictional world and are not a raging homophobe, there's no reason not to include them, even as a background detail.